‘I Wouldn’t Change Anything’ — Interview with Dan Hooker

Mixed martial arts is a sport full of amazing people. I don’t think there’s any other path in life, where you meet so many different personalities at the same time. Some are stoically silent, while others, on the contrary, love to trash-talk and make some noise. Sometimes this translates into the octagon: for some fighting is just about competition, so they approach it with calmness and almost a sniper-like caution. However, there is a second category — absolute maniacs (in the best sense of this word), who have the rare talent for turning any match into a real, bloody war.

Dan “The Hangman” Hooker, who is sitting directly across from me at Auckland’s City Kickboxing on this lovely afternoon on January 16, is just such a fighter. Any of his bouts is a must-see TV, while The Hangman himself is a unique testament to inhuman resilience and fighting ability. The athlete who has gifted us countless unforgettable moments inside the octagon, who calls a broken hand “just a scratch”, has been enjoying a small break from action, while rehabbing the said hand. Taking advantage of this unusual calmness that seems to have settled in his life, I got to catch up with The Hangman himself.

She Loves The Gloves: Dan, first of all — how’s the recovery going, what’s the update on the general timeline of you getting back in the cage?

Everything’s going good. I can see where it went sideways last time but now I’m doing everything right. As for the timeline — June. End of June. May jump on that McGregor card (laughs). I’ll probably be good to go in May but, you know, if it’s the McGregor card you’re willing to wait. There’s that extra gamble: what if someone gets injured at the last minute. Either of those guys, I could fight.

She Loves The Gloves: Plus you’ve already faced Michael Chandler…

Yeah, well, can’t go worse than that one, can it? That was like the worst possible scenario (both laugh). It can only get better after that.

She Loves The Gloves: Alright, I gotta ask — what’s the sudden (or not so sudden) fascination with tattoos? Is it like a reset, or you just finally get the chance to do this while you’re injured? Since I think it’d be pretty rough to train with a freshly-done tattoo.

Definitely. I made it work, but it’s easier now. To be honest, it was something that never interested me, it had never crossed my mind. And then I had some time and started. Everyone’s different, everyone’s got their own bodies and what they like. It’s just something I like — big tattoos, long sessions. I enjoy the process. It’s your body and you’re getting it to be the way you want it to look. It’s a lot of time, a lot of pain, a lot of money that you invest in it. But in the end I get it to look the way I want it to look. They say it’s addictive. But you go on a tangent — I just did the chest and then I realized that it looked unbalanced, and now I needed to add some things to make it look more wholesome.

She Loves The Gloves: Did the leg one hurt?

Yeah, but then it’s like a mental test. I couldn’t train, couldn’t fight, so I found another mental test. Sitting there for a couple of hours is alright, but 8 or 10 hour sessions… But I kind of enjoyed it.

I have never really taken anybody’s opinion into consideration. I absolutely love it. I don’t really read my comments but I’m told a lot of people comment on my tattoos negatively…

She Loves The Gloves: Seriously?

Haha, yeah, but I get a lot of love for them as well.

She Loves The Gloves: I don’t know, man. I think they’re absolutely sick and also very unique. So fuck the haters.

Always fuck the haters!

She Loves The Gloves: Alright, let’s talk fighting. I’ll try not to ask anything you’ve been asked before. Which one of your past fights would you relive and why? If you could experience it one more time.

That’s the beautiful thing about our sport — you only get one shot. Every fight teaches you something, every moment is special. To try to recreate it wouldn’t be right. Regardless of what fight it is, I always feel like I could do it better — whether it’s a win or a loss. So to try to go back in time and recreate something… I wouldn’t change anything.

She Loves The Gloves: You wouldn’t want to have the same experience?

I want it to be… better! My UFC debut in my hometown was special. But if I went back to it now, it just wouldn’t feel the same — now I need higher stakes. Being the main card, being the main event, title implications. It’s like a drug, you get used to it, you want more.

She Loves The Gloves: Okay, then let’s go in the other direction — if you could get one of your losses back — just one of them. Which one would it be?

Ah, [Michael] Chandler. Totally. Again, you can’t fuck that up any worse (both laugh). It really can’t get any worse.

She Loves The Gloves: Yeah, unless you trip on your way to the octagon or something.

Yeah, just fall down the stairs and break my arm. (more laughter)

She Loves The Gloves: Jokes aside, though, you did seem very frustrated after that match ended.

Yeah, I was very frustrated. But that’s the sport. It teaches you humility. The universe has a funny way of teaching you the right things at the right time. At that moment in time I need to be told to shut up and be humble. Like “you need to improve in these ways”. And I got that lesson.

But, in all honesty, I wouldn’t really want to take it back. I have no ill will towards the situation. Without my losses I wouldn’t be the fighter I am today. It just doesn’t work like that. You develop most of your character through tough tests and hard fights. To take one of them back would mean that I’d lose that learning experience.

She Loves The Gloves: And what was this learning experience in that fight? What went wrong there? Didn’t expect him to start so aggressively?

No, the biggest lesson from that was that my team, my coaches, everyone told me not to do it but I was so young. It was during Covid, so I had to stay in Dubai for 5 weeks, then quarantine back in New Zealand for two more. So, seven weeks in total. And none of my coaches could come with me. My ego got in the way. I thought I could do it without preparing properly, thinking that I was so good that I could do it without my team around me. And the universe showed me that, in fact, I need the right people in the right places to achieve things.

It was a huge lesson and that’s why I wouldn’t take it back. Since that fight I’ve just been so grateful to be surrounded by my team, so much more grateful for the hard sessions and for my training partners, for the knowledge that my coaches share with me. For them missing time with their families to travel with me. I wouldn’t take any of that back.

She Loves The Gloves: Who was your toughest opponent?

Me (laughs). Your toughest opponent just brings out the best in you, that’s all they’re there for. A fight is a fight. But the only reason I haven’t been able to live to the best of my potential is because of self-doubt or mistakes in my game. Ego, or not training properly, not listening to the right people. It’s always me. There’s nothing I couldn’t have done in the octagon. There’s no one that I couldn’t have gotten out of there.

You do this long enough, you knock enough people out and you realize: we all bleed. You might think that when you’re younger, you get in there with someone and you think you can never beat that guy. But in the gym you see that it’s not like that. I’ve trained all over the world and we all get tired, we all bleed, we all have bad days. There’s no such thing as superhumans or enigmas. I know we can all get knocked out.

She Loves The Gloves: Do you have a favorite win?

Probably UFC Auckland against [Paul] Felder. It was just that moment… They way the fight went, just an absolute dogfight. The manner in which it was such a tough battle that went on for five rounds for it to be a split decision. Standing there in a packed arena in your home city. Just the relief of that moment — there’s nothing like it.

People think that when you win you’re excited. But the main emotion is just relief. Because to go through all that preparation to just get knocked out or something… in front of 10,000 people that you know. It’s your home, it’s where you live. At some stage I could have interacted with a big part of the people that were there, you know. So just to get that win there, it was amazing.

She Loves The Gloves: Chael Sonnen talks about this often. He says that in every other sport it’s a home advantage but in MMA it’s actually a home disadvantage.

Yeah, but there’s a balance to it, too. Fighting away from home, you don’t get the same energy from the crowd but there’s a lot less pressure. So there’s pros and cons. They are just different experiences and you learn to navigate them all.

She Loves The Gloves: There’s a lot of talk about G.O.A.T.s in MMA right now. Who’s yours?

My G.O.A.T? Anderson Silva.

She Loves The Gloves: That’s a proper pick. And is there anyone you’d like to fight before you call it a career?

There’re a lot of fights that can be exciting, the landscape changes so quickly. You can’t really hold on to [the idea of fighting someone in particular], otherwise, at that point you’re just hurting yourself and impacting your own growth. I wouldn’t want to fight someone because I hold any ill-will for them. But as far as cool fights go… Gaethje maybe? We need to do this one day.

She Loves The Gloves: Oh God! I can already see the pictures of you two from the hospital.

Yeah, no doubt about that (laughs). It needs to happen one day.

She Loves The Gloves: Count me it, that would be a sick fight. But, in your opinion, what’s the hardest part about being a fighter?

Honestly, I don’t know. I absolutely love this shit. I love everything about it — the hard sessions, the injuries, even the weight cut is a good challenge. Genuinely, in my heart of hearts, I love it all. You never get a feeling like this from anything else. Why would I be as fit as I am now if I wasn’t going to fight another person? Why would I run unless I was getting chased? I cherish it. At the end of the day, when I come home and I’m tired, I still cherish it, because I know it won’t be here forever.

She Loves The Gloves: Believe it or not, but what you’re saying actually makes complete sense to me… But one of your fights that feel like it will be here forever is of course the match with Dustin Porier. What are your memories from that fight?

A lot of learning experience. The lessons I’ve learnt in that fight is what helped me win my last two. Just the level of composure I saw from Dustin, when things weren’t going his way, when he was down two rounds. And he just never lost his composure. He actually got more composed, as the fight went on. I remember thinking “Why aren’t you freaking out? Why are you so calm? What do you know that I don’t?”. And it helped me in my last two fights because at first my opponents were winning but then they look at me and they start freaking out, just like I did — “What do you know that I don’t?!”. And now I know a lot of things they don’t because of my experience. But yeah, the fight with Dustin was cool. It’s cool to watch it back and be like “Oh, that was a cool fight.”

She Loves The Gloves: Must be a cool feeling to know that you’re one of the two people responsible for giving the fans that fight.

I didn’t even know, to be honest. After the fights I only talk to a couple of people, even the media that I talk to — they’re my mates. Regardless of how things go, they will be supportive. So at first I didn’t really realize it. But then it grew over time. Other people started coming up and saying how much they enjoyed that fight.

She Loves The Gloves: Well, I’m sure there will be a few of those in the future.

For sure. I feel like everything has kind of come together in the last year or so. Everything has fallen into place and I really do know something that others don’t. There’s no pressure to go out there and prove it, but I almost feel like it’s inevitable.

She Loves The Gloves: Was there a moment when everything kind of clicked?

I wouldn’t say it was a moment — more like a process. It’s not just one thing, it’s something that I’ve done consistently. Everything that I’ve done throughout my career. Even the losses. Every time you lose, you have to look at yourself in the mirror and ask yourself “why did I honestly lose?”. And then be honest in your response, which a lot of fighters can’t do. They will blame it on their team or something else. But you have to be able to openly say “it’s because I fucked up: I didn’t do this, or that”. So it’s a process, and you go through a whole catalog of them.

Your experiences are your ego check. Everyone’s good, explosive, and unbeatable when they’re coming up, but what happens when you get knocked down, knocked out or choked out? Can you still be that guy? I can still go into a fight and still be that guy, still feel that way, be aggressive, knowing full-well that I can get knocked out. But can you have that confidence and fight like you’re invincible, genuinely believe that in your heart, while at the same time you know that you’re not? That’s the true secret.

She Loves The Gloves: Now, about those who seem invincible. Do you think Islam Makhachev will stay on top of the game for long?

I don’t know — it’s up to him.

She Loves The Gloves: And what do you generally think about that skillset? Why is it so hard for other guys in the division to figure out? I mean, Khabib terrorized that division for so long, now Islam is doing the same…

Well, it’s that, it’s what you just said: “terrorized the division”… Having been there with Islam, it’s not like that. It’s that mental aspect. They have been painted as these superhumans, and everyone around them just genuinely believes that. It’s the mental aspect is the thing that overrides it. I feel like it’s the myth of “Dagestani this and that”. I feel like that is bigger than the actual task at hand. If you were to get that shot again and treat him like the human that he is, things would go very differently. And that’s the benefit of experience.

She Loves The Gloves: Alright. One last thing and I’ll let you go. If you could change one thing about the sport of MMA, what would it be?

Probably invest more money into the long-term health effects of the sport. Researching C.T.E. and stuff. It’s important for people to make an educated decision before getting into MMA. It’s not necessarily to prevent people from getting involved in it but just to have enough information on what the consequences can be. So they can make correct decisions, train smart. Because life is long and you’re gonna need your health for all of it.

She Loves The Gloves: Well, there’s nothing that I could possibly add to that. I wish you the best of luck with your health and recovery. Thank you for talking to me. I’m sure the readers will enjoy this interview just as much as I did. Can’t wait to see you back in that cage!